dualislogs | [Closed] What is friendship

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[Closed] What is friendship

WHO: Squall & Seifer
WHAT: Talking about their issues
WHERE: The workshop outside the city
WHEN: Aug 11 forward dated!
WARNINGS: Possibly things related to child soldiers, mind control, neglect, abandonment?

Ever since that near-disaster of a conversation early last month, Squall has been thinking about how to approach things with Seifer. There's no question they have a lot to talk about, and even more hurt feelings to navigate. The fact that they got out of that one without a physical altercation was a surprise, but hopefully a sign that they do want to work through things.

Still Squall has been putting it off. Talking about feelings has never been his strong suit. Made worse by the sheer reminder that he had let Seifer down back then. He doesn't know what to do about the resentment, the notion that he's 'perfect', or that 'good things fall in his lap'. He can't help but wonder if that's how a lot of people saw him. It bothers him.

He leaves a simple text message for Seifer the night before:

We should talk.

He gears up for the long walk to the workshop early next morning. Boko stubbornly tailing him. The chicobo more of a comfort and distraction that he's willing to admit. By the time he gets there, Boko is half-asleep in his arms and the thoughts in his head have worked its way into an indent between his eyebrows from frowning so much.

He bought breakfast for them though. Some cheap unhealthy fast food.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

"Sounds crazy, right? I thought so too, until a lotta people confirmed the story. Hell it wasn't even really him who told me about it until I asked."

Of course Seifer was skeptical at first, but seeing the work that man could do with primitive tools left him fairly certain that given access to better equipment he could absolutely fashion himself a suit of power armor. Seifer scooped up a pencil to jot down alongside the diagram the alterations Squall would have made to his own design. He'll adjust as necessary later.

They really should have actually talked about their shared weapon in the past, might have found they had a lot more in common than just beating the tar out of each other. Neither one of them was especially adept at being social, and even now it was still difficult. Yet this common ground was helping ease some of the tension. It's clear Seifer's passionate about this. He wants to build the best gunblades. Ones to rival even Lionheart.

It's strange hearing about Seifer's experiences in that other place. It does sound like it's been fairly good for him. A life beyond Garden.

He wants to treasure this tentative friendship between them. It might be the last chance he gets to see a different side to Seifer. The only chance to make things right. When he runs out of things to add to the current sketches, he's finished the last of his drink and poked at the fries that came with his food.

He shouldn't put this off any longer. He breathes out slowly and grasps at the edge of the table with his hands on either side of him, eyes on the ground.

"I want to continue that conversation. That night I asked if you still wanted to be SeeD."

It had been really good for him. Meeting people who didn't just want to use him for their own gain or tossed him aside outright had been an experience. Imagine suddenly having people care about you, just you, and not for what you can do for them? Well, Squall has that. It's new for Seifer.

Seifer's food and drink didn't last long, he was tempted to steal those fries Squall was poking at, honestly, having not thought to bring much food out there for himself. All this working and he wasn't feeding himself adequately. Gotta fix that later. He can tell there's something on Squall's mind, but figures he'll spit it out eventually if he just gives him enough time.

Of course he hadn't expected it to be that. He frowns darkly at Squall. Really? They were doing so well, too.

"What's left to say?" He thought he made himself clear.

Squall definitely has that now. It still feels strange but he doesn't want to lose it. He doesn't want to lose this either. His frown deepens at the expected hostility but he powers through. He has to remember it's worth it no matter how difficult it's proving to be.

"You hate me. I don't think I deserve all of it but I don't want it to hang over everything we try to do here. Friends... share their problems, right? We have a chance we might not get again, so... let's talk."

"I don't hate you," He's quick to correct. Hate is very different from this. Jealousy and resentment yes, anger over having been tossed aside absolutely. Not just by Squall, by everyone. To always be passed over in favor of Squall no matter how hard he tried. It all fed into a frothing anger, but not hate. Hate wouldn't have him here designing them both a new gunblade.

He heaves a frustrated sigh, running a hand back through his hair. Squall wanting to talk is unique enough he would be remiss to shove him away now. Especially after all the progress he'd made with Rinoa and Nida... it wouldn't be fair to not offer Squall the same courtesy. So... fine, he'll give him a chance. "Alright." He grumbles. Seriously he needs more food for this.

Wait, he doesn't? That gets Squall to stare at him incredulously. Then what the hell does he call that outburst before? Ugh. Why do feelings have to be complicated? He can't doubt it though. Seifer's been nice to him, cooking for him and expressing concern in his own way and... redesigning their gunblades.

Has he mentioned he hates feelings yet?

"Right." He confirms and leans forward, elbows on his knees this time.

"Do you know what happened after we fought Ultimecia?"

Seifer just stares him down defiantly. Emotions are hard, but all negative emotions aren't hate. That outburst was pain, not hatred. Well, not hatred for Squall, Garden yes. Probably Cid too, and Edea... While they might be kindly parental figures for the others, Edea herself is the face of torment for Seifer. He'll never be able to look at them the same.

Feelings suck. But they make them human. They need them.

He shook his head at the question, waiting for Squall to elaborate.

He'll have to learn not to see it as an attack. He's trying. Normally he'd be able to make decent observations but not when it's directed at him like this. With so much baggage between them.

But that's why he's here, isn't it? He scowls and looks away, back at the ground. It's very interesting, this floor.

"We don't exist that far in the future. To go home, we had to... think of a place important to us, believe in each other." He runs a hand through his hair. "I ended up at the orphanage but I went back too far. I saw matron..."

He closes his eyes.

"I was the one who told her about SeeD and Garden. What we're trained to do."

He'd thought about it since their argument. He wouldn't have done it any other way. Couldn't.

It is definitely not an attack. It might be defensive. Seifer's volatile, Squall should be accustomed to that much. The baggage is heavy between them, but Seifer is trying to make an effort... He's just not always great at it.

Right. She was from the future. The Time Compression thing... he didn't know many details. Only that it happened. "You traveled even more through time?" How the hell did Squall manage that? Wait... Understanding slowly dawned on his features.

"So... all of that was kinda your fault?" It was a tease, a slight smirk went along with the accusation. Followed shortly by a shrug and a shake of his head. "Doesn't matter. Never had a fuckin' choice anyway. No reason we couldn't have been better prepared." No, Cid failed them by choosing not only not to say anything but by giving them amnesia spirits to boot.

He is used to that but full out resentment from Seifer is... new, especially with what he knows now. Not much at all, admittedly but more than before. The question gets a shrug. He doesn't know. It feels like sheer luck that they made it to the castle and out again as successfully as they did. And that's with his experience in the void.

His eyes widen at the tease. It stings a little but seeing the smirk makes him force himself to smooth over the ruffled feathers. Seifer's not wrong, even though it sucks to hear. He rubs at the back of his neck.

"I guess so. I ended it so I had to start it?" Hell, he has no idea. He never studied time magic. "I don't think Cid was ever prepared to fight matron. It wouldn't have mattered to me what I was training for either." But it could have helped Seifer. And Squall would have known what the hell he was asking for in D-district.

Welcome to knowing things you never wanted to, Squall. Seifer hadn't wanted to share, things just came out when the right buttons were pushed hard enough. Squall had done a fine job of that the last time this conversation came up. Luck. Always with the luck. Squall had it in droves. Bitterly Seifer wondered when he might ever get a slice.

"Guess. Fuckin' time loops." That's all he really knows. It was a time loop, it'd happen regardless and they had no other choice. He just wished he'd not had to play the part he did. Seifer twitched a little at the name, Matron, his jaw tightening. Going a little pale. Don't mind him he's just mildly freaking out. "Cid's a fucking coward who made you do his dirty work." He hisses, loathing clear in his tone. Now if Squall wants to know hate, that's what that sounds like.

They could have been better prepared. Maybe he wouldn't have jumped into her service the way he had. Maybe... hindsight was always so much clearer, wasn't it?

It came with over ten years of learning how to be an asshole. Sorry. He'd argue that Seifer had found some luck now if that ever came up in conversation.

Time loops. He wonders if that's all that is with what he's seen in the void. He doesn't want to talk about that though. The genuine hate in Seifer's voice comes through loud and clear.

"I know." He doesn't hate Cid as intensely. He's mad, sure, and the man will never have Squall's genuine respect. But he's just a sad old man who got in over his head. He sounds distracted when he speaks again.

"It's too late for us but there are still junior classmen in Garden. Maybe... I can give them the chance we never got." An option for a normal life. Not just missions and death.

Luck that he's desperate to cling to and not share because Squall's here, and Squall's a threat to his luck. A threat to his everything.

Had Squall been on the receiving end of being constantly shafted he might think differently of Cid. As it was there were numerous times Cid could have stepped in, stepped up, done anything that could have changed the course. At least given Seifer some hope before he had to go serve the Matron they'd all forgotten. Even after, he could have at least spoken up.

But he didn't, because he was a damned coward. Useless, like all other adults in their lives.

"If you want to do that then Garden needs to stop existing as it is. A meat-grinder of war orphans for profit."

That's exactly the kind of fear he doesn't know how to reconcile.

Squall has been shafted in a lot of ways. It was just done in the name of being the fated savior. For him to 'grow'.

He thinks about Xu, about Quistis. Xu might be against it. He and Quistis have grown close enough that he can probably talk things out with her. Even with friends, the role of Commander is isolating. The others can support him but they don't have the insight Seifer does. Squall doesn't have it.

He looks at Seifer, weary.

"I can't change it alone."

It's one that might go away on its own so long as Squall doesn't just magically absorb everything he's worked for and leaves him the loser with scraps again. It's not one Squall can fight on his own.

He has been, he absolutely has been. None of this has been easy for Squall and Seifer knows as much. He just can't help the envy and resentment. Life hasn't been good to either of them.

Xu would be the hard sell. She liked the status quo, she was in it for the profit. Convincing her that it's fucked up to make the victims of wars go fight more wars would be a hard sell. Even if it shouldn't be.

"What, suddenly your little squad doesn't have your back? They'll go through time with you but can't figure out this much?"

The scathing sarcasm positively drips from his words, as does the underlying jealousy. It's unfair, he's being an asshole about this, he knows it. But what the hell does Squall want him to do? He's the enemy, remember? Set Galbadia Garden after them? Probably got a lot of people who used to know of him killed? Yeah not exactly someone who can just come waltzing back in.

~~He's not Kirby, Seifer.~~

Squall winces at the sharpness of the words, balls his hands into fists in response. Anger spiking before getting pushed back down. He's not here to fight, he reminds himself. It takes him a second but he relaxes his hands again.

"They'll try but none of us saw the problems the way you did." He hesitates, mulls over the words. He's watching Seifer again, his eyes hoping for something. "You don't have to be exiled from Garden. I know you don't want to come back and it won't be easy but there's still a place for you."

He looks down at his hands again. Why is it so hard to put his feelings out there for scrutiny? But he doesn't have a choice. He has to if he wants something to change.

"I'd... give you a place to start over."

~~He might be!~~

"No one cared," He growls, leaning back and folding his arms to stare Squall down. "You think they're gonna care now? Even with you as Commander?" Squall could demand it, sure, but it'll take a lot to change the overall culture of Garden. He's not leaving, but he still doesn't look exactly eager to jump at the prospect. Even shakes his head slightly. "You know there's no way I can go back. How many remember what I did? How many are dead because I commanded Galbadia soldiers to board?"

There is no place for him. Possibly nowhere on that world anymore. "I can't just waltz back in like I never betrayed the place." Sure they forgave Edea, but why would they ever extend him the same courtesy? They never extended him a courtesy.

Still... Squall's open and almost helpless honesty did seem to be wearing at his walls. At least he was losing the hostility in his tone. Instead replaced by... resignation. He is a monster to the world now, he gets it, there won't be any walking back from that.

"You can't put yourself at risk over me."

Squall looked troubled as he listens. Why is Seifer putting all the blame on himself? He was controlled. And they did exactly what they were trained to do - follow orders. Squall would have done the same if their positions were reversed.

"I'm the Commander. I'll do whatever I want," he says bluntly, squaring his shoulders and folding his arms. Even tries to sound haughty though it's closer to huffy teenager. He drops the act fairly quickly though and looks at Seifer again, putting one hand on the table between them. An unconscious act of reaching out.

"I care. So does Nida. The friends you made in that world, Fujin, Raijin..." He breathes deeply, having a hard time maintaining eye contact with what he's about to say. "We have to... let people in too." Yes, he's more than aware of the irony of him saying this.

Moving on. More pragmatic than emotional now.

"You're an asset to Garden. You had access to the Galbadian army. You're the only other gunblader in Garden and you're too strong to be let loose without someone watching you... And I need someone who'll challenge how Garden works."

Look at all those ins, Seifer.

Because he's having a hard time accepting that he was controlled. Because it felt too easy if he did. Because Seifer has always held that bar high, especially for himself, and if he was controlled then that's yet another personal failing. Where he was too weak and fell for her tricks hook line and sinker. Almost easier to simply hold himself wholly responsible for his actions, at least then he wasn't such a weak helpless fool.

"Yeah I'm sure that's gonna go over real well," He drawled, rolling his eyes. The huffy teenage Commander was going to inspire a lot of confidence. He frowned slightly at the hand. Not unfolding himself from his defensive arm crossing, but not moving away either. Squall's trying, which is weird, because no one tries. No one has ever tried for him. So why the hell was Squall wasting his time now? Didn't he realize that Seifer was by design disposable?

"Now, if you even remember when we go back," Which he doubts. He's pretty sure no one remembers. He wants to remember, so he doesn't want to go back. Though he does seem to wilt a little at the mention of his posse. Them he does miss, he does regret leaving them behind. They probably won't forgive him for this. "..." It's not that easy, Squall, he should know that.

As for the pragmatic, it's a lot easier to defend against the pragmatic. "Tryin' to offer me a leash ain't exactly a good sellin' point. What's the next suggestion, the reminder that when Garden needs to make use of the scapegoat I'm gonna be sold off the moment it's convenient? I ain't never been an asset that's not easily replaced. And if it's between one worthless cadet's life or a war, guess what's more reasonable to pick? Off with his head, that's what. Besides, I'm too old, Leonhart. I can't even pass the fuckin' exam you think anyone's going to agree to take me back on board? I was due to be out on my ass anyway."

Pragmatism isn't going to work here. Pragmatic is what Garden is, pragmatic would deem him too much trouble to work with. They both know this.

Squall's face colors by the end so he finally looks away, trying to suppress the rising doubt that he's not made for these kind of conversations. It's not surprising but it's still shameful how bad he is at this. Should he stop before he accidentally makes things worse? But that will put them back at square one.

"I can make you SeeD. You'd be as disposable as the rest of us." Seifer more than proved himself capable in the field. The only thing he wasn't good at was following orders. Squall shakes his head, frustrated. "You're right. I can't change the core of Garden. I think... Nida might be proof of that." He frowns. He doesn't really know what happened to Nida still. Just that it's another sign of a predetermined future. He's leaning forward again. One hand behind his neck. The other still on the table.

Gloomy. He has plenty of reason to be.

"What do you mean 'if I remember'?"

They were never taught these things. No role models. No guidance. Everything a matter of figuring it out themselves. Sometimes they muddled through, Seifer learned so could Squall.

Squall just had to learn that hope and pretty words only worked when you had fate on your side. "So, extremely," He remarks flatly. NORG was willing to hand Squall to the Sorceress to appease her, does he really think all of that is gone? He does nod when Squall concedes the core is rotten.

It's a starting point.

"Odds are you'll forget. We've got no proof any of this translates over back to our world." He makes a thoughtful sound, loosening his defensive hold on himself. "What will you do if you do remember?"

It's still there but Squall has the power to fight against those decisions now. And in exactly the position to have to make those decisions for the greater good. It's not really an enviable position.

The idea that he'll just go home without any memory of this place is nothing short of alarming though. When will the world stop messing with their memories? His grip behind his neck tightens. He almost misses the question.

The look he gives Seifer is almost deer in headlights. It grows thoughtful soon enough.

"I don't know. Try to keep things together. Change what I can." A pause. "I don't want to forget anything here."

It really isn't. Win or lose whatever decisions Squall makes someone will be unhappy. Worse yet,
people will get hurt and some might die.

Yeah, Seifer understands that look. He moves to heft himself up onto his work bench to rest. No point in standing around for this.

"If you forget, it's a moot point. You won't even know I'm gone," Because he still doesn't plan on going back. Not yet. "If you remember, do you think you've got what it takes to change things? Garden as it is has to go. Be gutted completely and rebuilt from the ground up. The whole damned thing's rotten, and probably the very source of what creates Ultimecia."

It's the only explanation for her deep unflinching hated.

Squall falls silent again, sighing softly before he speaks.

"If I forget I'll still notice you're gone. I just won't know why." The idea that he'll just up and forget Seifer is laughable. Unless the GFs take that too. The rest of that though. Does he really have what it takes? Him, the guy who prefers to stick to the status quo.

"I don't know." It's an honest answer. He really doesn't. "I don't know what's waiting for me as commander in peace time." There's the damage to Garden, the loss of faculty and income, loss of SeeDs and cadets, training the remaining students...

His frown just deepens as he considers all that. Can he change anything if he's too busy trying to patch everything up?

"Doubt it. You're gonna be too wrapped up bein' the unwitting political puppet of world leaders," He snorts. Why does he say this? Because Squall's uncertainty hasn't instilled any sense of confidence. Not that he can't do the job but realistically speaking neither of them are really ready for the world they're stuck in. Put in positions to act as leaders when they don't even know who they themselves are.

"Ever consider just not bein' Commander? Or makin' Garden not military? Or hell, getting rid of Garden all together." Or Squall just outright leaving. That's an option too.

[Closed] What is friendship

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